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Russ Larges
Moderator

USA
2492 Posts

Posted - June 05 2021 :  8:53:19 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
OK here it is. The .38 spl. and the .45acp or are hands down the best two cartridges in production today. I know because I said it was so . I will get into the rifle calibers on a later date, you will have to wait for my comments on them. It is worth the wait as I am seldom wrong on anything.
I do use the .45 auto rim some also. Any comments will be admitted so go for it.
Russ

The pistol, learn it well, carry it allways. Jeff Cooper

Ace
Advanced Member

USA
5993 Posts

Posted - June 05 2021 :  9:12:04 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I remember once I took a 9mm to the range, along with a bag of extra ammo. Emptied the gun, opened the bag to reload the magazine, and had grabbed the one with .45acp. That day it wasn't such a 'best' caliber..... Ace

Give me $1 every time a Liberal lies, I'll give you $5 every time one tells the truth; I'll end up a wealthy man, you'll end up broke.
If pro-gunners are as murderous as anti-gunners claim, why are there so many anti-gunners still running their mouths?
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Pop Pop
Advanced Member

USA
1467 Posts

Posted - June 06 2021 :  08:22:26 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I carry a 7 shot 2" 38spl/357 mag every day. I have found some 38 Spl self defense rounds to have almost the same recoil as the "preferred by me" Cor Bon DPX 357 load. Boo on the 45. Thats my story and I am stikin to it! Bring it on 45 lovers.....Got me some CCI snake shot for my days at the farm.

Edited to add; Here in Mid TN, they are saying if you see a big sekada(S?) tree, stay away. Copperheads are hanging around feasting on them. Don't need to tell me twice. They are not out here yet.

Pop Pop

Edited by - Pop Pop on June 06 2021 08:25:46 AM
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Chris Christian
Advanced Member

USA
3824 Posts

Posted - June 06 2021 :  1:36:24 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I like .38s. I have 2 snubbies and and one often rides in my weak side pants pocket. I also have 3 full-sized Ruger GP-100 guns that I shoot in competition with .38 handloads.
But I'm a bigger fan of that 9c M&P that rides quite unnoticed in a strong side holster under an untucked shirt. Its 16 rounds of Speer Gold Dot 124+P (cranking about 1200 fps) are more comforting than the 5 in the snubby, and far more robust in both numbers and power. And if I need more there's a 15 shot mag on my left hip.
As for the .45 ACP...I never liked it, even when shooting on Navy Pistol Teams where it was mandatory. Much of that stemmed from the 1911 platform, which I still abhor. I did play with a M&P 45, and won First Expert with it at a FL State IDPA Championship match. But, if I'm going to tote a primary other than the 9mm it'll be my G29 10mm. More compact... fits the same holster as the M&P 9c, and tosses Win's 175 grain Silvertip at a clocked 1230 fps. 10 rounds in the gun and a 9 round spare mag on tap. And, it's not a 1911 ... works just like my M&P 9c. That's my story, and I'm stickin' to it
I normally know better than to jump into a "caliber war trap". But, it's Sunday and I'm having a Stupid Moment

Chris Christian
There are those who make things happen. There are those who watch things happen. There are those who wonder What The Heck happened! Pick one.
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Frogfoot
Senior Member

USA
904 Posts

Posted - June 06 2021 :  5:46:51 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Mr. Russ, have you been kidnapped and your captors are forcing you say such wicked, wicked things? Clearly your statement must have been made under terrible duress and it was really a coded cry for help. Has to be. No other rational explanation. Anyway, what you meant to say was that the two best cartridges are the .357 Magnum and .40 S&W, right?

We make a living by what we get, we make a life by what we give. - Sir Winston Churchill
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Ace
Advanced Member

USA
5993 Posts

Posted - June 06 2021 :  9:43:44 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Nah. The .40 is just a fad and will never last, just like those plastic guns. And I don't know why anyone would dislike the 1911-style guns. It's far and away the finest combat handgun platform ever designed--which I know is true because I read it somewhere. Ace

Give me $1 every time a Liberal lies, I'll give you $5 every time one tells the truth; I'll end up a wealthy man, you'll end up broke.
If pro-gunners are as murderous as anti-gunners claim, why are there so many anti-gunners still running their mouths?
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Arvinator
Advanced Member

USA
5608 Posts

Posted - June 06 2021 :  10:09:37 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I got ugly looks and criticized by my bosses back in 92-93 when I told them I felt the .40 was a fine caliber, but would not stay in the limelight long. I Carry a 9MM on duty, and a 38 snub as backup. Off duty, I have my discretion and I feel well armed with my choices. I do admit I am still fond of a 4 inch K frame revolver, even with fixed sights....

Be honest, fair, and always prepared...
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Evan
Administrator

34857 Posts

Posted - June 07 2021 :  1:17:44 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I'll be getting Big XS night sights this week by a local gunsmith on my 7 shot L frame .357 revolver. I'm still not fond of night nights but at almost 79 I can't see the red ramp clearly anymore. So, I'm carrying two J frames until I get the L frame back. I have a small stash of .357 and .38 DPX. One that is exhausted I'll probably go back to Federal.

"The greatest thing a Father can do for his children is to love their Mother."

Harold B. Lee

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Pop Pop
Advanced Member

USA
1467 Posts

Posted - June 07 2021 :  2:55:31 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Evan I want to get a green pipe sight put on my revolvers. I too am having problems seeing the red ramp. Found a Smith that said he can do it.

Pop Pop
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Ace
Advanced Member

USA
5993 Posts

Posted - June 08 2021 :  05:20:14 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Fingernail polish is cheaper---and such a variety of colors! Ace

Give me $1 every time a Liberal lies, I'll give you $5 every time one tells the truth; I'll end up a wealthy man, you'll end up broke.
If pro-gunners are as murderous as anti-gunners claim, why are there so many anti-gunners still running their mouths?
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jle3030
Advanced Member

USA
5716 Posts

Posted - June 08 2021 :  10:03:06 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ace

Fingernail polish is cheaper---and such a variety of colors! Ace


And you can match whatever you're wearing on your fingers and toes!
Does the sparkly polish help to pick up the ambient light?

Jeff

jle3030

Edited by - jle3030 on June 08 2021 10:07:31 AM
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Pop Pop
Advanced Member

USA
1467 Posts

Posted - June 08 2021 :  10:03:07 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I painted a blue model 10 front sight with florescent red fingernail polish. Smith told me to put a coat of white then paint the final color over the white. Turned out very nice and bright. I want to try the light collecting pipe sight. Got one on my mdl 317 22 LR revolver. Really like it, but one needs external light for it to perform well.

Pop Pop
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Ace
Advanced Member

USA
5993 Posts

Posted - June 08 2021 :  1:04:31 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Jeff, the tactical advantage of using sparkly polish is the same as having a teal-blue or lavender pistol---the big tough bad guy gets to laughing so hard, it gives you time for a couple extra shots. Ace

Give me $1 every time a Liberal lies, I'll give you $5 every time one tells the truth; I'll end up a wealthy man, you'll end up broke.
If pro-gunners are as murderous as anti-gunners claim, why are there so many anti-gunners still running their mouths?
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J Wagner
Junior Member

222 Posts

Posted - June 09 2021 :  09:50:00 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Pop Pop

I painted a blue model 10 front sight with florescent red fingernail polish. Smith told me to put a coat of white then paint the final color over the white. Turned out very nice and bright.


I followed the same advice from someone and liked the result.

I got a really odd look from a female employee once, when I told her that her fingernail polish would look good on the front sight of my pistol.
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dawei
Junior Member

USA
195 Posts

Posted - June 09 2021 :  10:52:30 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
My preference for the last 50 years has been the 38 Special. My primary carry since 11/2014 is an S&W® M&P® BODYGUARD® 38 Special CRIMSON TRACE® SKU: 10062. My BUG is a Charter Arms® steel frame UNDERCOVER® 38 Special DAO #13811. I carry both guns every waking moment of every day. I also carry speed loaders and Bianchi® speed strips. I DO NOT feel undergunned.

Regards...

David

Only two defining forces have ever died for you:
1. Jesus Christ.
2. American Soldier, Sailor, Airman, & Marine.
One died for your soul; the other for your freedom.

1Cross+3Nails=4given
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hopleyyeaton
Junior Member

USA
134 Posts

Posted - June 16 2021 :  1:04:28 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Cartridges? Maybe one of these days when it gets laborious to grab an ember from the fire and put it to the touch hole.
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jle3030
Advanced Member

USA
5716 Posts

Posted - June 16 2021 :  8:16:52 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Not editorializing here; just listing some numbers I ran across the other day. It is once again becoming popular to use .38 Special wadcutter ammunition in snubby revolvers. The idea being that expansion from 2" barrels is an iffy proposition; expanded bullet penetration, when it happens, is often inadequate; so plan instead for excellent penetration with a caliber hole cookie cutter bullet.

So what do we end up with?

Ballistics101.com shows the Black Hills 148 grain wadcutter bullet at 700 fps velocity; 161 ft-lb muzzle energy. Barrel length not specified.
Lucky Gunner Has Winchester Super X 148 grain wadcutter @ 713 fps from a 2" barrel.

Other references show the old late 1800's .38 Long Colt, 148 grain LRN @ 750 fps; 175 ft-lb muzzle energy from the Army's 6" barrel Colt 1892 service revolver. This is the notorious setup that sent the Army back to the .45 caliber guns when the .38's proved unreliable against drugged up Philippine Moro tribesmen.

We can each draw our own conclusions, but I found the numbers and history interesting.

Jeff



jle3030
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oldmuleskinner
Advanced Member

1034 Posts

Posted - June 16 2021 :  10:50:23 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Primary is a G-26 with a G-19 mag full of 115gr JHPs.
The backup is either a S&W Airweight J-frame .38 Special with 125gr Hornady JHPs, or a KelTec P3-AT with 95gr JHPs.

If I'm out bowhunting (we have black and grizzly bears around here), primary is a G-20 with 180gr JHPs.
The backup is a S&W 317 with CCI Stingers.

Each of us is an innkeeper, and we decide if there is room for Jesus.
Neal A. Maxwell
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billmc
Senior Member

557 Posts

Posted - June 19 2021 :  12:25:27 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by jle3030


Other references show the old late 1800's .38 Long Colt, 148 grain LRN @ 750 fps; 175 ft-lb muzzle energy from the Army's 6" barrel Colt 1892 service revolver. This is the notorious setup that sent the Army back to the .45 caliber guns when the .38's proved unreliable against drugged up Philippine Moro tribesmen.



See that. There's no problem. We don't have any drugged up Philippine Moro tribesmen in these parts. The drugged up tribesmen we're likely to run into are from tribes called Crypts, MS-13, Bloods, etc; no Moros; so all is good.
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jle3030
Advanced Member

USA
5716 Posts

Posted - June 20 2021 :  11:35:28 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
When we try to name the "best" cartridge, that begs the question "Best for what?" If the answer is "Best all around", the the .38Spl is arguably the winner. That is, given the wide range of factory ammunition loaded in that caliber and the variety of firearms available to fire the cartridge. At the low end we have .38 wadcutters, gentle enough not to abuse older airweight snubbie revolvers or recoil sensitive shooters. At the other end we have +P+ loads that edge into low end .357 Magnum territory. Available guns to fire the .38Spl range from Scandium snubbies up to the old N frame S&W .38/44 Outdoorsman or the Colt New Service. Or any .357 Magnum revolver. And then there are the various .357 Magnum carbines that also can run most .38Spl loads.

One could easily argue that the .357 Magnums, being able to shoot any .38Spl, are the more versatile guns. But if the discussion is the cartridge itself, in the various factory loads, then the .38Spl checks more boxes than any other handgun caliber that I can think of.

Jeff


jle3030
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gauchobill
Advanced Member

1185 Posts

Posted - June 21 2021 :  10:07:11 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
9mm is a better cartridge than the 38spcl because it is a more compact cartridge delivering equilivancy in terms of penetration/expansion if not better than 38spcl. It will handle hard lead bullets (round nose, please) and others in weights from around 90gr through 158. More importantly, ammo seems to be much more abundant in 9mm selections.
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